Thursday, October 05, 2006

This deserves the light of day

So often, comments to posts can get lost in the shuffle. This one (which came in moments ago) was just too special to leave in the stack:

Anonymous said...

MIKE

You are a bully, and damaged at Bellevue. You need to check what your saying with God. If you have a relationship with him, listen.

9:39 AM, October 05, 2006


I have a few requests for you, whoever you are:

1) Please quote specific things I've said, written, or done that qualify me, in your mind, as a "bully." I know that since the anti-Bellevue crowd started this nonsense, I've prayed for--and publicly hoped for--an amenable resolution to it. I have invited those involved with savingbellevue.com to post here, since their associated sites do not allow for discussion, or even permit the posting of comments that are critical of their efforts.

2) Please define the term "damaged at Bellevue." In whose opinion? In what areas? To what extent? If you have some double-super-secret insider information, please share it.

3) Please highlight the things I've said, written, or done that give you the notion that I don't "check" what I'm saying with God. For your edification, there hasn't been any post or comment I've written regarding this entire situation that hasn't been prayed over; more than once, the Lord has prompted me to use the "Backspace" key and either rephrase or delete sections of posts and comments. And, sometimes, whole posts and comments.

4) Please give me the Biblical support for feeling comfortable in questioning my salvation. To my knowledge, no one who is critical of the anti-Bellevue group has made the nauseating leap you just made.

Whoever you are--if you've ever heard Adrian Rogers speak about nasty, venomous letters he had received, you've heard him make the astute observation that whenever people lack the fortitude to at least sign their names to their criticisms, those criticisms mean nothing.

If you cannot respond to those requests (either in a comment or to my e-mail) without clearly and plainly identifying yourself, there's no need to bother. And if you do choose to identify yourself, keep in mind you'll be claiming ownership of your above-quoted unfortunate remarks.

Your call.

--Mike

12 comments:

RightKnight said...

Hey Mike,
I just found your blog and have very much enjoyed what I have read thus far. I have been following what I like to call “the seeds of dissention” blogs and am very disappointed about what I have read. Ok ok, I’m very angry about what I have read. What’s even worse, in my opinion, is that some people are more willing to believe unfounded rumors and gossip over their God appointed leaders. For those people I quote, “Obey those who rule over you, and be submissive, for they watch out for your souls, as those who must give account. Let them do so with joy and not with grief, for that would be unprofitable for you.” Hebrews 13:17 – NKJV. Those dissenters have run head long in to a spiritual mine field. “My son, fear the Lord and the king (our authorities); do not associate with those given to change; for their calamity will rise suddenly, and who knows the ruin those two can bring?” Proverbs 24:21-22. The insinuations and false accusation that these people have made against their authorities make me call into question their spiritual condition. Not their salvation mind you, but their spiritual condition. On Wednesday, August 16 at Bellevue, Voddie Baucham said, “Show me someone who is not submissive to their authorities, and I’ll show you someone who is not living the Spirit filled life.” Of course the dissenters will say that Dr. Steve Gaines had him say that to help him out.
Well, any way. That’s about it for now. Keep up the truth and the good work. I’m praying that this will soon be put behind us so that we can get on with storming the gates of Hell.

Patrick Patterson (I added the last name because I love the truth and am not afraid to stand up for it)

Anonymous said...

I hope these people are happy. THIS is why MS and others MUST stop. From the CA comment site on the article today:

Choice 3
"This is why I don't do church, especially one's like Bellevue.. It's more like a corporation than a space of spirtuality..."
October 5, 2006, 1:59 PM

Anonymous said...

Mike,
I have found your blog site to be quite interesting. It seems that you are quite steadfast in your belief that our Pastor is a man of integrity. I pray that he is! So, as one who has yet to cast his voice of opinion in either direction, I wonder why we, as the body of Christ at Bellevue, could not have a meeting to openly discuss the issues?

Concerns:
Why are salaries secret? I usually don't suspect someone of doing anything wrong until I see them wisper!

Why all the changes in the CFO office...Parker resigns, Freeman resigns, Freeman returns???? I was quite satisfied that things were fine in the Finance Office until I heard of all the changes.

Was Jamie going to Gardendale and Steve coming to Bellevue all part of the master plan...or was it really the Master's plan?

Who really has integrity? I am told that parties on both sides of the "fence" are men of integrity. I have only known Steve Gaines for a short time and I don't know Mark Sharp....so how do I really know which of these men have integrity? I have friends who say that Mark Sharp is a man of integrity while I have friends who say the same of Steve Gaines.

Does anyone REALLY know????

I only seek the truth.

Dacus Grant said...

Mike,

You are a blogging genious. Your insight on destroying the baseless allegations of Mark Sharpe and his cohorts is amazing. You deserve an award, and a website with a ticker that doesn't recognize unique IP addresses. Most importantly, you reinforce your comments with excellent spelling and grammar.

I am sickened by the left-wing approach these self-proclaimed "lovers of Bellevue" are undertaking to do whatever it is they are trying to do. I question their motivation.

only a member said...

Mike -
I have written once before but I did not get posted, so I will try again. I tend to be a little cynical about things in life.(I hate that I am that way but that is who I am.) I am a Christian and trust the Lord. I would like to hear your insight on how you can be so trusting of Bro. Steve. After hearing all the stuff out there, it seems like it is so much more than a personality conflict between a few men. It seems like some integrity and character issues to me. Let me know just how you can blindly follow a man - of the flesh - b/c that is what we all are while we are here on this earth. That's the cynic in me, sorry.

only a member!

john 16:33 said...

Very uncool of savingbellevue.com to post the email address of each deacon. This sets them up for every spammer in the world to grab their email address. Regardless of which side you are on that is uncalled for.

Cary said...

New - from the creators of www.SavingBellevue.com, it's www.gbcsaved.com

Check them out today... How was Germantown Baptist saved? What steps were taken in the process? If another church is going through the same thing, what steps should we take? You'll find the answer to those questions and so much more in a new 285 page book all about how Germantown Baptist overcame a problem and how your church can too!

Purchase your copy today. It's only $15, plus $6 shipping and handling. Order 5 books at once and you can save up to $9!!!

Now...it all seriousness, it looks like the Saving Bellevue folks are looking to make a few bucks off of all of this. To my knowledge, that website hasn't been launched yet but it looks like it will be soon...

-Cary

Josh Tucker said...

I have a general question to pose. What reason is there to expect that administrative and ministerial changes will not be made when a new pastor takes the pulpit at a church or vice versa? Who should decide how these matters are handled? As a side note, the deacon body is looking into the possibility of creating a personnel committe to oversee staff additions and subtractions.

Specifically (and this is addressed to those who are presently uncomfortable or disagree with the staff changes), with regard to Steve Gaines, is the issue the fact that personnel changes are being made or the rate and extent of the changes?

Now, about keeping the church finances confidential and private. While I do believe that there needs to be a degree of openness and oversight with regard to Bellevue's finances, I'm not sure it would be wise to open the financials up to the public or the entire church membership. Primarily, there is the danger of giving out too much information which could be used to gain access to church financial accounts or compromise church financial dealing with the public or private sphere.

There are also other security risks to consider. For example, if Bellevue ever had any financial information that could be linked to missionaries overseas in countries that are hostile to Christians, there is the potential that their lives could be placed in danger. Once the church's financials are opened to the public, it will be impossible to confine to the membership alone.

The use of financial officers and deacon committee oversight should be sufficient as a compromise between total access and complete secrecy. And, yes, there is a certain amount of trust and faith that is placed in these individuals.

Salary levels should probably be kept confidential as well since, I believe, there are discrepancies in pay according to length of service, need, etc. A compromise would be to publish a salary range with a low end and high end for various positions without revealing specific salary amounts for individual ministers and administrative staff.

notonlyamemberbutsomuchmore said...

To Anony @ 9:29 on the 5th, consider this:

1) Why are salaries "secret". They are not secret, they are PRIVATE. It is no one's business what people make. Invariably, someone is going to see it as too high, while others (but fewer) will see it as too low. From what i can tell, MS and his cronies feel that the pastor should be a pauper, which is insane. So, you are a pastor, and therefore you and your family eat crumbs. That is the opinion of a self-proclaimed PK who in his own self-righteous mind believes he knows what a pastor should make, disregard the fact that an entire committee sets that pay. I dont want my pastor to be poor--our former pastor wasn't. What is blatantly hypocritical is that none of them seemed to mind how much our former and beloved pastor made (and remember, comp is FAR more than salaries, but is also perks and other things bestowed by the family, such as sending him to Spain, paying for children to come home for special events, maybe deferred comp/retirement, all of the birthday/anniversary gifts, etc.). That's why this is insane--double standard clear as day.

2) CFO Office: why did parker leave? dunno, but he's gone. and IF he is the one breaking the confidence of his former position by telling stuff to MS, then shame on him--that is at best morally wrong and he should repent. Where i work and i'm sure where most people work, breaking any confidence like that results in being sued, so whoever the finance leak is in my opinion should get slapped with a lawsuit. Freeman--he was going into private employment but then changed his mind. People do change their minds about employment--may not have been what he thought.

3) Fence-jumping: the biggest bunch of nothing. that has been so blown out of proportion it is shameful. no one ever felt threatened or intimiated (heck, he wasn't home). they have just used it for embarrassment and for NO OTHER PURPOSE. otherwise, call the police and file a complaint if you are really concerned about it. its shameful and disgraceful that they would try to embarrass the man that they openly admit and ackowledge was called to be our pastor--they dont even question that, but yet they disrespect him which is CLEARLY against scripture.

Finally, who appointed them to "save" Bellevue. Bellevue does not even have to exist, so did they have a dream or a vision or hear a voice from God that they are proclaimed to "save" Bellevue? No--absolutely not. I love Bellevue and pray that its work continues on until Christ returns. But Bellevue does not have to exist. MS is arrogant and prideful beyond any measure or comprehension to think that he has the right to PUBLICLY call for the pastor's resignation. The fact that he has allowed this go into the media, and the fact that he supports libelous webmaster shows he has no character and is a self-condemned man.

Mike--you haven't put anything on your page in awhile. Now that savingsaving is going down, we would appreciate you keeping the faith!

Anonymous said...

10/09/06 5:56 pm. Do you not understand this is a public blog, and you condem others for going public. You are truly talking out of both sides of your mouth.The Bible says people like you are a fool. Don't be a fool. and Don't encourage Mike to continue this. You encourage others to sue brothers?? Look what is coming of this public display. Please repent and ask God what your measure should be.

notonlyamemberbutsomuchmore said...

Mark Sharpe and his folk are the ones that took this public. Its out there, and they are attacking our pastor and our church, and therefore ME publicly. Because of libelous webmaster and his lies and misrepresentations that are posted on the web for anyone in the world to read, there is no choice but to have some public discussion of this. They take down their website and stop self-promoting in the paper and on tv, Mike should (and I am confident will) pull this down, too.

You obviously just don't get the point about the lawsuit, so I dont even need to address that.

Anonymous said...

We say Mark Sharpe is a man of integrity. Look at who has his name plastered all over the Commercial Appeal, a "Saving Bellevue" site that does NOT allow ALL Bellevue members to post responses, only those who have negative comments, or copies of administrative letters they twist to their view. When comparing look who is REALLY causing damage to our church? Who is causing the doubt and discord? MARK SHARPE! If he Really cares about our church then he should write a public apology for all of this noise and negative press for all of Memphis and the world wide web to see. If this is not going in the direction he or the few other malcontents want, then they should leave and find a church that suites them. Interesting that Bellevue has a membership of over 27,000 members and they can only publish names of only a handful of people with open letters???? Less than 1% of the church body? This is a democracy, majority rules. The majority are happy, obviously. I don't understand if they don't feel right about the pastor of the direction of our church why they stay? Why were they at church today?? They were there to cause problems, and continue to open a wound. We have answers that have satisfied the "majority" of church members. If the worst attacks that can be made are a pastor is arrogant, he went to visit and discuss in private, (an not a public forum for airing dirty laundry in public, had a dinner with a famous paster (David Jerimiah) and other key members, and he wants to put an end to a loud and squeaky wheel, then that's o.k. with me. Pastor Rodgers stepped down to let the next generation come in and lead our church. If God has led this man, then we are to follow. It is not christlike to publish deacons email addresses in an attempt to humiliate and antagonize............look at the actions and words of these that are unhappy. Why are they blasting emails on this site????? Why would he play a loop about contacting a deacon with copies of their emails??? They were responded to harrasing emails, and not the structured, formal and professional way in which questions may be responded. There is a proper way for things to be handled. Mark Sharpe, and the saving bellevue site is nto the way. Why should any further communication be continued with Mark Sharp? He doesn't want closure, nothing will satisfy him, he wants to cause problems. If not then why doesn't he pull his emails, open letter and other garbage off the website? He has made his point, his voice has been heard and ENOUGH. Move on and focus on God, not Mark Sharpes agenda. We are fine with our church and pastor. Majority rules! God oversees all.